Curse

BahamutKaiser · Apr 03, 2006, 04:56 AM // 04:56

Probably the most attractive additions will be the upcoming classes and others like it in the future. Having several types of classes allows players to find something that they find interesting and enjoyable, the more classes the better. But no amount of classes will introduce certain characters, One in particular that I am interested in playing, as well as a few others.

I could write a paragraph about how I like dragons, but I'm sure you know that by now, a lot of players like dragons, and playing as dragons. Thing is, a dragon isn't a job, it isn't even an added player race, it's a new species altogether with different mechanics. I would like to play as a dragon, In GW, I'm sure if they add enough classes I will find one that I really enjoy, but it won’t replace the sheer satisfaction of playing as a dragon.

Because a Dragon can't function as many of the jobs in the game, And because the simple use of a Dragon, or other creature of like magnitude, is a lot more potent, at least in feeling, I think a character like this should be limited to unique attributes which are available to that species, and either be harshly limited, or not be able to access a sub class, and cannot be subbed by normal characters.

Basically the idea for playing a dragon would be that the species would have its own 4 or 5 attributes, more or less, and not have access to a sub class. This "character" could be balanced well enough to make it a fair addition, it obviously wouldn't be a large dragon like glint, just because of the space issue and the limited power necessary to make it balanced.

This doesn't have to be limited to dragons either, there could be griffins (hopefully not those hybrid things in the desert), Giant Birds (perhaps something like a phoenix), Behemoths, Land Serpents, Kirin, Name a mythical creature, just not too many.

The idea here is that you would have extra playable classes, that don't revolve around the same class combinations or class combining altogether, but separate classes which is less versatile, but fun to play. A beast of such sort can't hold a weapon, and is limited at best to any armor it could dawn, but as a beast it would have natural built in armor as it levels, or it could actually enchant its own hide, by collecting materials and going to an enchanter of some sort which could improve their armor, Kind of like infusing.

My personal interest though is Dragons, so I'm prepared to develope some ideas for attributes and what kind of abilities it would introduce to the game.

First of all, The kind of dragon I'm interested in is a Western Dragon 2 arms, 2 legs, 2 wing Dragon, actually glint is a great model, but smaller and less heavy set. But like any human player, a Dragon would do well with some customization, from skin color, Dragon physical types, facial shape, and type of horns, tail tip.

These are more customizations than human players have, because dragons wouldn’t be wearing much if any armor, the customization differences would play a bigger role in the look of your character, humans choose how they look, but what armor they wear and what dye they use makes allow them to greatly redefine their appearance, for players using dragons, coloring the skin, and the underbelly would be the only "dying" they would do, and that's all chosen at the beginning of the game.

As for body types, you can't very well have very large dragons running around, and since they can't change out armor types the build selection would range from different kinds of dragons, from wyverns (2 wing with arm capabilities, 2 leg dragon, like reign of fire), western dragons of a few types (2 arms and 2 legs as well as wings, or 4 legs and wings), and maybe even eastern dragons (serpent dragons with arms, like in spirited away).

Having maybe 7 to 10 different looking builds would be a good start, all of them would have to have claws and the ability to fly in order to keep the same attributes and skills among them. The character model would take up about the same space as a blood drinker, or a dokyl, but not because it is wide, it is because of the wings at their sides.

Basically the Dragons attacks would consist of Breath attacks, which would be one attribute, ground attacks, which would be done with the frontal limb, either claw, or for wyverns their wing which is also an arm (like a bats). Aerial, which would include flight modes and hind leg attacks wile airborne. And a survival attribute. Now for flying, this doesn't mean they fly off the screen nor are unreachable, but when they are flying melee attacks do less damage, wile Arrows and/or projectiles can do more damage, or knock them out of the sky after losing a certain amount of health.

The dragons attack damage would be determined by his level, similar to pets, and their armor would scale up by level automatically as well, so buying armor wouldn't be available to a Dragon, because his armor is built in, but at least 1 piece of equipment should be available, like a necklace or neck piece, not as armor, but to grant the added energy and regeneration that other jobs have. The base health and energy amount and regeneration would be the same as humans, but their single equiptable item would grant 5 energy, 1 health regeneration, and 1 energy regeneration. There could be alternate pieces available as you progress, which swap for 2 health and added energy regen, or vice versa. This would also be the piece of equipment used in a Dragons infusion. For now we will call them collars, this would be similar to headgears and different collars would have different +1 attributes on them.

So the attributes are Breath, Claw, Flight, and Dragon.
The breath attribute would encompass ranged attacks, from elemental type projectiles, stances which change the Dragons attack to ranged or it could be a skill which causes the dragons attack to stay ranged if equipped, like Acid spit or Fire balls, not really different then a wand attack but more ranger like potency. Breath attribute increases the power of breaths and ranged attacks. These are usable on the ground or in the air.

The Claw attribute would encompass the dragons ground attacks, not all of them would be claw attacks, some would be bites, or tail whips, but the claw attribute would increase the damage delt wile meleeing with claws, as well as increase the damage of claw attribute skills, similar to Warrior masteries. Most of these skills and the claw attacks can only be used wile on the ground. Claw attacks would be slashing, Tail attacks would be blunt, and fang attacks would be piercing. The regular attack would be the same speed as a hammer attack, and the damage would scale up by level, at level 20 a dragon does the same max damage as a hammer. Again, added points in claw mastery would increase the damage just like a weapon mastery.

The Flight attribute would encompass Flight skills which would be activated like stances. The attacks in Flight attribute are only useable wile in flight. Flight would be activated like a stance, but it wouldn't be a stance, it would be a flight status. Some flight skills would be attacks which launch the dragon into the air, some are special flight skills which allow a certain kind of flight but limit other moves, But the main mode of flight would be a skill which has a maintenance of 1 energy. Flight offers a unique tactical advantage that isn't available in other jobs, being in flight allows the dragon to move over top of other players, which aids in chasing and escaping, wile in flight the dragon takes 25% less melee damage, but takes 15% more damage from ranged attacks, and 10% more damage from other flying attackers (dragons in flight). If they added spears as a weapon to an upcoming class then spears would do the same damage on a flying target as it does on a grounded target. They could also add a knock down effect, if his health is reduced by 50% then there is a 50% chance that a projectile attack will knock him down, each point in Flight attribute would reduce that chance by 2% for a maximum of 24%, or 36 with a Flight rune, reduces the chance of being knocked down by a normal attack to 26% or 14% respectively, but when a dragon is knocked down he takes 50 damage. Also, moves which cause the actual status of knockdown have a 25% chance of knocking a Dragon out of the sky. Earthquake and aftershock wouldn't work on a flying dragon, but Gale would have a 100% chance of knocking a dragon down out of normal flight. As for flight attacks, like wing smashes, Dives, Tail whips, and hind claw attacks, all are improved by flight attribute. It really depends on how effective flying dragons are, if they don’t prove to have significant advantages simply by being able to fly over enemies, than they don’t need a knock down effect, they could even leave out the whole damage plus and minus for melee and ranged attacks, but I can’t be sure since I can’t test it.

The Dragon attribute, for lack of a better name, would cover the Dragons defensive skills, from regeneration and self healing, to defense stances and buffs. Points in dragon attribute would increase defense by 1 point, and chance of critical strike by 1% per point. Base defense for a dragon at level 1 is 22 AR, at level 20 its 60 AR, that’s 2 added armor per level, points in dragon attribute would increase armor by 1 point of armor per point in this attribute, for a max of 60 base armor and 12(16) armor for this attribute. Skills in this trait would be akin to troll urgent and healing signet, a corpse eating move which increases health regeneration would be a good one, and other unique moves for the jobs would also be in this attribute. They could alternately make the armor 70-80 just by default armor level on lvl 20 dragons, and change this attribute to increase his physical and skill damage by 1 damage per attribute point, and increase health by a small amount for each point in Dragon. This seems to make more sense to me, as Dragons should be heavily armored, and would naturally have more health than a human.

Basically what you have is a very cool character to play, the attributes are a lot more versatile then classes, but you can't make a combination with dragon so you only have what this character has to offer. Players would typically stress claw and dragon attributes for heavier armor and melee damage, very similar to a warrior, or they would likely stress breath and Flight, which would have a similar effect as an elementist/assassin or ranger/assassin. They could also build a Flight and Dragon attribute build for high defense and powerful aerial assaults. Depending on which design was chosen for this class, it could work many different ways.

Dragon has a high potential to use several if not all of his attributes at once, but with the same amount of skill points and skill slots as other jobs, he will most likely stress two or three. And wile the dragon would have a rune for each attribute, he only has one piece of equipment, so he can only equip 1 rune. Notice there is only 1 rune for each attribute, which adds 3 points to that attribute, and for Dragons, no penalty. I say this because Dragons can't stack several runes, unlike other jobs which can use up to 5 minor runes or like combinations with vigor runes as well, a Dragon can only use 1 rune on his single piece of equipment, so there are only 4 runes and they all add 3 points with no drawback. In comparison to a monk who can use 4 minor runes for each of his attributes with no drawback, and a vigor rune for added health, it is fair. On top of that a dragon can't use a vigor rune along with other runes to counter a drawback from a normal superior rune. They could also add a new kind of rune which adds 1 point to all of dragons attributes, that way he can improve all of them slightly instead of one by a lot.

I think A.net is a long way from including something like this into the game, but they heartily intend to make expansions/sequels every 6 months, and this game could last years, maybe a decade. After releasing several different classes people will become less interested in a new class, and eventually find their favorite and stick with it. As an original addition, beasts like Dragon could be made into playable characters, Dragons are widely popular, especially in fantasy games of this sort, and very attractive. Being the only "good" online game with playable dragons would sell thousands, maybe millions of copies, just because people love dragons, but not just dragons, other beasts could be added as well, Beast like Phoenix/Mystic Falcons, Kirin/Unicorns, Behemoths, and other creatures. This would allow the game to expand into richer character creations, and satisfy many players like me. I would hope something like this would come sooner then later, like in the 4th installment.

If anyone out there loves the idea of playing as a Dragon, please support this idea.

Dr Strangelove · Apr 03, 2006, 07:00 AM // 07:00

Hmmm, playing different races would be fun and has been brought up before. However, how would you make a dragon secondary? Keep in mind, these would have to be the same size as other classes for that, and for balance reasons (body blocking dragons?). Also, what style of weapons would a dragon use? They would have to be able to use all the weapons of the other classes.

The way I've usually seen new races suggested is for a shapeshifter class that would change your skills similar to the snowball fights.

arcanemacabre · Apr 03, 2006, 07:19 AM // 07:19

I don't agree with this idea for a few reasons:

1) There are many other (intelligent) species in the Tyrian/Canthan world that would be better suited played by players. To name a few, Grawl, Charr, Tengu, Dwarves, Forgotten, etc. Each of these species are much like the human characters in health/energy/skills/armor/weapons and could be easily balanced for competitive play.
2) Dragons are simply too big. As Dr Strangelove said, there would be definate body-blocking issues.
3) Over-population. Too many people would automatically look at the dragon race and think "ZOMG teh big UBAR-Fantastico PWNZOR! Rarrr!" and bam! Wayyyy too many dragons out there. No one would want to be human.
4) From an RPG standpoint, Dragons have always been the big antagonists. They're rarely in the top villan spot, but they always play a huge role (pun intended). Either way, they are not made to be played, strictly designed as NPCs.
5) Re-hash of #1... I would so love to play a Tengu or a Forgotten, there's some fun species!

Nevin · Apr 03, 2006, 10:21 AM // 10:21

Why Dragon?... Why not the more traditional races? Dwarves, Elves, etc etc.. Personally I'm satisfied with the different nationalities. After a while (Think 8 chapters) Each assumbly having a new continent, players are gunna look pretty diverse by the end.

Cottage Pie · Apr 03, 2006, 11:27 AM // 11:27

Quote:

3) Over-population. Too many people would automatically look at the dragon race and think "ZOMG teh big UBAR-Fantastico PWNZOR! Rarrr!" and bam! Wayyyy too many dragons out there. No one would want to be human.
4) From an RPG standpoint, Dragons have always been the big antagonists. They're rarely in the top villan spot, but they always play a huge role (pun intended). Either way, they are not made to be played, strictly designed as NPCs.

good points, esepcially 4. A dragon is simply too powerful to play, if it was realistic you kill everything in no time (see glint, most powerful creature in tyria).

BahamutKaiser · Apr 04, 2006, 02:36 AM // 02:36

Well I can see that many didn't read this..... it's nothing new on Guru, I remember these kinds of responses when the ideas for Ninjas and Asian content were brought up, Narrow minds, 0 forsight, and next to no reading.

Frist of all, Dragons are in hundreds of RPGs, so we arn't breaking barriers, games that actually let you play with dragons, few, and as the dragon itself, a hand full.

This concept if for Playable Dragons which are moderate size, which wouldn't take up any more room then perhaps 2 characters, primarily in look, with the wings span and such, but if anyone here read, it also has flight capabilities, which cause the least amount of character blocking period.

If anyone read, this isn't a "Class", it is a new playable character. It has unique attributes only available to dragons, and cannot have a sub nor be subbed. This is a new kind of playable character, not a new class. That much is right in the title, again with the not reading.

I expect new classes and even new races to be added in the future, but totaly new types of characters is the next leap after that. And I've already heard the bit about who thinks what is appropriate in the past, and I got hundreds of flames for introducing ninja concepts because so many "Pros" "Knew" that more classes would unbalance the game, and Asian content was unacceptable in GW. So if your trying to convince me that allied characters which are already in the game can't be redesigned into playable characters because they don't belong, your wasting your breath.

I didn't say anything about Glint sized dragons either, any character is going to have to respect the lvl 20 limit, and functional size as well as blocking. It's already in the game, but Glint lays eggs, Glint is the most supportive allie to the humans second being the dwarfs, who fight with and against you just like other humans. Dragons are ment to be powerful, but since they have to be balanced with other jobs, the unique difference to dragons would be the ability to fly, but they can't alter their built in armor nor can they sub a second class for diverse skill use.

I can't remember the last time I got a response from someone who could read a developed concept instead of making inaccurate protests, please surprise me next time. Dissapproval based on intuitive glances at the title don't amount to anything, I think the only thing yal saw was Dragon and started making up your own image.

Super_Nerd0 · Apr 14, 2006, 08:21 PM // 20:21

if you pet in a dragon, then we will get elves and dwarves and orcs and goblins and trolls-lets become LotR or maybe WoW

BahamutKaiser · Apr 15, 2006, 01:46 AM // 01:46

"put in dragons", Dragons are in the game, and a significant part of the storyline, as well as dwarfs, either you haven't played or your a moron.

And playing a dragon is about the furthest from cliche since, of the vast number of Games with dragons, the overwhelming majority only have them as some sort of boss or uber summon, being able to play them is an extreme rarity, and in a "Good" online cooperative/competative game, completely unavailable.

Here's cliche for you, only being able to play as humanoid characters (almost every game), only being able to play as humans (perhaps 99% of all games in any genre). Just because you see dragons alot, just like humans, sword fighting and magic casters, doesn't mean playing as the dragon isn't an extreme rarity and a popular selling point.

xiaotsu · Apr 15, 2006, 02:31 AM // 02:31

Want something different and more fantasy based? Go play WoW, leave GW with it's humans. Changing the game from what it currently is would ruin it, and would cause many players to quit, as WoW already covers the high-end fantasy part of RPG'n.

fiery · Apr 15, 2006, 02:56 AM // 02:56

Hm let's call people morons. I haven't seen a "dragon"(besides bone dragons) in Chapter 1, I may be wrong, I may be a moron but that seems unsure. But for one to be played as a race, seems kinda funky, to go from people to all the way to a land walking dragon. I seen one during FPE, sure.

Agreed, A.net said we won't have inter-species of races, this is why we don't have elves etc.

The closet race I see coming is a Tengu, hence the Tengu henchie.

BahamutKaiser · Apr 15, 2006, 11:57 PM // 23:57

If you haven't seen a dragon beyond the bone Dragon in Chapter one then you obviously don't look very hard nor know much about the game, protesting my perspective wile proving your ignorance is quite unproductive to your cause.

Glint which is the Prophet of the Guild Wars Prophecies campaign is a dragon, and she is an allie, the title of the game relates to the Ancient Black Dragon Glint. If you look at some of the murals and pictures in Ascolon you also see Dragons depicted. Furthermore, if there are bone dragons out there then they most likely came from long dead dragons.......

Besides that, when you actually reach Glint, the mission bonus entails her eggs which causes her to attack you if you try to grab them. There are dragons in GW, and there are Offspring.

Like most RPGs, Dragons got a serious helping of recognition. This isn't dungeons and dragons, where dragons are steriotypical bosses, and I'm not suggesting something that is in WoW either. The ability to play as a dragon is an extremely rare opprotunity, not being able to play as a dragon is like WoW. Where you get your analogies I wouldn't know, that's probably why I don't come up with broken analogies like you.

There is only one online cooperative game still around that allows you to play as a dragon, it never was very good, and it was nearly outdated when it came out, and it is far from current now. There are no games which allow you to play as a Dragon in a competative online realm. So playable dragons, yet again, is about the most original addition you could consider for this game, not a rip off, not cliche, not available anywhere else.

This is something that isn't in any recognized or good game to date, and isn't in any game remotely like this, Dragons, along with other playable creatures, are about the most original addition to a game like this that could possibly be considered.

You say "Changing the game would ruin it". Yeah right, if that is the motto to GW then there will never be another expansion, nor a new class (which we are gaining), nor new cultures (asian cultures which we are gaining), nor new playabe races, new skills, or even new playable characters. 0 insite, again, this is just a much more powerful addition then any other considerable additions (changes) to the game.

Yet again, not even remotely close to presenting a reason why Dragons shouldn't be in GW as playable characters. But thank you for the bump, which is the only thing you accomplished.

Here is a link to one of my first works, done only a month or two after the release of GW. The suggestion is outdated, but the point made is very clear, by reading the natural chain of responses to the idea, and then the obvious outcome of our upcoming expansion.
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=10656

This is just another idea that is simply more inspired then anything considered by the general player, when I made the Shinobi concept, players thought that GW couldn't have new classes, would never have asian cultural content, and plain out couldn't understand. All of which ment nothing, because it was more then obvious that there would be new expansions, and the best addition to those expansions would be new classes. As for my Dragon suggestion, it may be beyond what developers had originally considered, but still a perfectly viable addition, it is no more unacceptable then adding new classes, it is just too large for you 8 players to consider. You dable in ideas for new classes because it has already been established, but your no better then the generation before you that thought anything outside of what is already accepted in the game isn't an option. I wouldn't be surprised if A.net didn't eventually add Dragons or any other playable characters outside new races with universal class builds, because it is a very extensive addition, but it is perfectly reasonable and acceptable, you 8 are simply blind.

darkdragon99 · Apr 16, 2006, 01:01 AM // 01:01

it's kinda funny how ppl are always bitchign about the new class suggestion are unoriginal but when one comes along that is it's too original

pyrohex · Apr 16, 2006, 03:18 AM // 03:18

Well thought out. However, it suffers from one basic flaw - it's not in the spirit of Guild Wars. There are, as someone above said, more viable options to be considered before a dragon.

Yes, dragons are part of the Guild Wars context/history, but I doubt we're going to be able to play Forgotten (which are the serpents you supposed to be dragons) anytime soon.

Assassins were not within the context of the game at the time of suggestion. Try imagining a Japanese samurai running around in ancient Rome, and you'll have a comparable parallel. So unless you feel like planning an entire chapter of Guild Wars (Guild Wars: BEAST EDITION!) for ANet, get off your high horse and stop believeing you have been vindicated.

Syi · Apr 16, 2006, 03:33 AM // 03:33

"BahamutKaiser" Hmm..Bahamut. Dragon-like character. :<

A huge post about dragons...

"Guild: The Obsidian Dragons" ...That explains it. You're obsessed with dragons, but not everyone are.

BahamutKaiser · Apr 16, 2006, 01:19 PM // 13:19

Not everyone is obsessed with Assassins either, does everyone have to like it in order for it to be enjoyable for some?

As I have shown, I have been vindicated, I've had to hear mindless denial before, and I have outstanding evidence.

I agree, that there are alot of "simpler" additions that A.net could excersise, more new classes, new playable races, some game engine modifications, but no matter how much they add, or how many class combinations they make, there will always be room for new characters.

This concept for new playable character focuses on dragons, but isn't limited to them. Even with 50 classes and their combinations, making Creatures which have unique attributes only available to them will still have an original spin on how the game can be played, and even more so, what you can play it as.

As for stating the spirit of GW, and what fits, you can go back to the shinobi thread and read more about how people think something doesn't fit because it hasn't already been added. Simply to say, it is well within the guidelines of developement in Guild Wars gameplay, it is simply a radical idea. Radical, but still balanced, still possible, and still considerable.

I know that comparing first generation class concepts with first generation original characters is very broad analogy, it was obvious that new classes would be added whether people agreed or not, wile New characters like Dragon are possible, but most likely not planned on. That doesn't mean that they wouldn't be a great addition to GW and that they could certainly add the content.

New, original content is something GW as a rapidly expanding game Will Need. If you consider the addition of new classes in each expansion, and expansions coming out twice a year, your talking about a dozen playable classes in the next year. When I made the Shinobi concept I made an all inclusive martial artist because I figured they may only expand a few times, and because I myself recognized the difficulty of adding several classes. When the decided they would add many new classes in the future, the basicly half shinobi, Assassin class, was actually a great idea, since preserving Samurai type concepts would be useful in filling another popular class role.

This game is still very unique compared to other online competative games, so they will likely not have direct competition for a long time. As well, this game has a rich playerbase and foundational content, allowing for it to expand for several years. If Guild Wars is to continue smoothly, adding original content will have to be a norm for the series. Not just an occasional plus, but an Every Expansion kind of thing, and after getting a few new classes, new classes will not be very original, nor constructive to enriching the gameplay, after getting a few new playable races, new races will cease to be original and enjoyable. New playable characters, and we arn't limited to dragons, is the next big leap of interest. This is something rarely available in Online RPGs, not to mention that this is a pioneering gametype, meaning no other alternatives can be considered for branching interest. This game has the potential to involve something of this magnitude, and it is a strong advancing and selling point for the game.

It would be perfectly acceptable to make an entire expansion with the primary additions being 2 or 3 new playable creatures, A dragon, perhaps A Griffon or large bird simular to phoenix, and perhaps A.... Unicorn or Kirin (something for the girls). The addition of new playable characters is more then acceptable for additional content in an expansion, it is definetly your dollars worth, and they will have plenty of epansions in which one or two could include this. Once they fill out the class lineup, it may even be easier for them to make just 1 class and a new playable creature, or simply 2 creatures.

I have a nack for forsight, I naturally develope concepts beyond the general publics scope, just because it will be another six expansions before the general public realizes something original like this could greatly improve the game, doesn't mean it isn't a great idea. And I let my record speak for itself, because like I said, I was vindicated, I got flamed by newbies and "pros" alike, but I was still resoundingly justified. Every time I come up with something radical I get newbie flames saying go to some other game which already has this, well first off, those newbies probably left GW for WoW already because they arn't very commited, or they are sucking up their bullshit and are glad to see themselves wrong wile buying the next expansion. More over, there isn't a single good game out there that has this kind of content. The last game to come out with playable dragons sucked before it even came out, the graphics were already weak, and the gameplay isn't anything spectacular, it is more then outdated at this point. This game would command a dominating monopolization over Dragon player content in the online gaming industry.

And it is important to note as well, that using up all of one kind of content before coming out with something new is poor planning. Which simply means, waiting til you have exhausted all your original class options and playable races til you add the next level of originality will only serve as a tombstone rather then a refresher. It is important to mix in your most original concepts between the addition of new classes and races, to keep the game rich, and to further enrich the originality of new class additions, only adding new classes til they are exhausted will just make the additions monotonous.

P.S. I could have swore I heard this before, "It's not in the Spirit of GuildWars", why don't you read some more replies in the shinobi thread for 300 examples. The game Will Change, it Will Grow, it Will Expand, but in what way?, not known, but definetly not limited by your imagination.

LightningHell · Apr 16, 2006, 01:28 PM // 13:28

Hey, I would maybe support this if it weren't dragons.

Crazyvietguy · Apr 16, 2006, 01:46 PM // 13:46

I think if they added more dragons as enemies, it could spice it up a bit, give them their own ablities, etc. As said before a dragon race, not gunna happen. But to see more dragons so i can figure a build to farm them, im all for it

. Im thinking they will be like E/W... and i like unicorns, screw dragons (dont recommend doing this).

BahamutKaiser · Apr 16, 2006, 02:01 PM // 14:01

Whether you appreciate Dragons or can envision them in GW is your personal scope. Whether or not you can accept the idea doesn't determine what Anet could or could not use.

A young Dragon doesn't have to be overpowered, you can kill hydras and drakes regularly, and bone dragons are only so tough. Dragons can grow to be indominable forces over the centuries, but since we arn't playing in the lifespan of a dragon they would reach a medium point and stay there for characters. There can be characters from a species fighting on both sides, just like many of the creatures that fight along side many enemies.

Another response copied/pasted out of the Shinobi Thread, thanks anyways Crazy.

darkdragon99 · Apr 16, 2006, 02:21 PM // 14:21

well BahamutKaiser you can't really think these guys would like any idea what so ever did you? i mean these are the same ppl who have been flaming the new class concepts for the last 4 months for being unoriginal that or when one comes around that is original there is no way that could work it doesn't fit in gw .

TheOneAndOnlyX · Apr 16, 2006, 03:27 PM // 15:27

IMO dragons are the nerdiest and by far the most unfitting race for guild wars you like dragons so much, why not play dungeons and dragons then?